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Nov 24, 2007, 01:02 PM // 13:02
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#1 |
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Forge Runner
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Canada bro.
Profession: A/D
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Fix'ing Assassin Utility
To prevent crowding of Moriz's topic, or overshadowing of his idea.
I think there should be a topic dedicated Moriz topic is more dedicated to making sure the assassin can't do over powered dagger combos. This one is just about their utility Im just offering ideas, and would hope that you join me in doing so. Contents Critical strikes lulzors1 Dagger mastery lulzors2 Deadly arts Lulzors3 Shadow arts Lulzors 4 Unlinked Lulzors 5 Shuuda's: Shudda2 Critical Strikes Lulzors1 [card]Sharpen Daggers[/card] While it applying bleed is good, why wouldn't you just put jagged strike in this slot? Letting Sharpen daggers be. Many GW players suggest: Make it a skill yum suggests: Make it inflict cripple whenever you attack a moving foe. -Apply bleeding blah blah, if you critical strike you apply Deep wound for 10 seconds. -Or make it apply bleeding but your attacks have +5 damage. Otherwise sharpen daggers is somewhat mediocre to dagger assassin [card]Seeping Wound[/card] -The degen stays the same, but perhaps it should inflict Cripple if you do a critical Strike on that foe. Making Seeping wound a way to give +10 degen and a snare. -Or make it degen but , target foe takes 50% less effect from healing. I prefer the first form, as the second form doesn't use critical strikes. Yum suggests: Make it 2...8 health loss (not degen) per second. [card]Dark Apostasy[/card] For 3...14...17 seconds, every time you successfully land a critical hit, you remove one Enchantment from your target and gain 5...30 health. If you remove an Enchantment in this way, you lose 10...5...4 Energy or Dark Apostasy ends. [card]Deadly haste[/card] Changed to Half-ranged and Touch Spells. This would synergize with Shroud of Silence, and other touch skills which mean's the assassin needs to put less attribute points in Deadly arts for them to work. and 5 energy, Or 5 energy. This skill's potential is easy to reach and it allows use of Disrupting/crippling dagger for quick cripples and disruptions. However with its 10 energy cause its a bit more annoying to fit on a sin bar. [card]Way of the assassin[/card] +10 % chance to Double attack. [card]Locust's Fury[/card] 15% chance to critical (not + chance, so it doesn't add up straight) Yum suggests: Make it non elite, stance. [card]Fox's Promise[/card] Whenever you fail to attack, you do 4..25 damage to all adjacent foes Fox's promise becomes like Sand Shard in a way. Tyla's suggestion: if you fail to attack you do 20...40 to all adjacent foes Dagger Mastery lulzors2 [card]Flashing Blades[/card] , Changed duration to 5. 17.24 changed recharge to 20. Deadly arts ,This one is rather large and tricky >.> lulzors3 [card]Assassin's Promise[/card]Changed to 1/4 cast. [card]Augury of Death[/card]Becomes Touched Foe, -yum suggests: Make both you and Target foe gain deep wound. [card]Crippling dagger[/card] 3/4 cast time. cripple changed to 5. 14..17 [card]Disrupting Dagger[/card] now gives 1...4....7 disable. [card]Dark Prison[/card] duration changed to 2...8...11 [card]Enduring Toxin[/card] And all adjacent foes. [card]Expose defenses[/card]5 energy. [card]Expunge enchantments[/card] 5 energy, or 20 recharge., perhaps both. [card]Impale[/card]Changed back to original hex form, does 5...79...89 damage on your next dual attack applies deep wound if you critical. [card]Lift enchantment[/card]Remove 1 enchantment from target foe, if foe is knocked down remove 1....3..4 additional enchantments. [card]Mark of Death[/card]10 energy, now does 50% less healing [card]Mark of Insecurity[/card] and cost an additional 5 energy.,20 recharge. [card]Scorpion wire[/card]20 recharge, changed to 200m 3 second knock down 15 recharge. [card]Shadow Fang[/card] recharge 30. Tyla suggestions: recharge 40 [card]Deadly paradox[/card]All your assassin enchantments last 50% longer, all hexes have 50% less duration. Shuuda Suggestion: Current deadly paradox stats but affects your next 1...3 skills. [card]Shroud of silence[/card] Target foes spells are disabled for 7 seconds, all your spells are disabled for 10....4..3 seconds recharge 18 (9 seconds with high deadly haste) (inspired by someone whos name I forgot) [card]Siphon Strength[/card]Foe can also not critical. [card]Shameful Fear[/card] 1 second cast time, 5 energy, 12 recharge. [card]Siphon Speed[/card]Changed to and you move 25% faster, 1/4 casting time. [card]Way of the Empty Palm[/card]10 energy, duration changed to 5...28..34 Shadow Arts lulzors4 [card]Beguiling Haze[/card] Reduce, energy cost to 10, increase Activation to 1 second, Turn to half range, and let it affect all adjacent foes. or. Full range, now affects all adjacent foes. Not a huge problem in pvp as people shouldn't be bunching up, good in pve now for aoe daze. [card]Blinding Powder[/card] 1.recharge lowered to 15, duration changed to 2....11...13 (11 is 12 Shadow arts) Or make it affect all Nearby foes cast time 3/4. [card]Caltrops[/card] Either make it full-range for for what it cost now. Or make it 5 energy, 15 duration. 2nd option makes it good with Deadly haste, and promotes a half-range utility build. [card]Dark Escape[/card] Remixed natural stride, 12 recharge, duration 2...8...10, or, Recharge 20, duration 3....11...13, 33% speed buff [card]Death's Charge[/card] 3/4 cast time, recharge 25 [card]Feigned Neutrality[/card] Revert to original form, armor reduced to +60 [card]Heart of Shadow[/card] Target ally, makes it good for /A secondarys or A/* itself. [card]Hidden Caltrops[/card] Either 1/4 cast time, or 4 recharge. Not both. [card]Mirrored Stance[/card] Whenever target foe enters a stance, that stance ends and you enter it. Recharge 10. [card]Shadow Refuge[/card] Lose 1 condition, you gain +3...7...10 Health regen (nerfed), conditional heal boosted to 25....78..90 [card]Shadow Shroud[/card] Recharge 15. [card]Shadow of Haste[/card] Revert to original factions form (not the imba form) [card]Shadowy Burden[/card] Snare removed, armor deduction increased to 35 [card]Shroud of Distress[/card] 1/4 casting time, 30 recharge. [card]Unseen Fury[/card] you cannot be blocked by blinded or dazed foes. [card]Vipers defense[/card] The next time you are struck you take no damage and are teleported to a random nearby location. Poison decreased to 3....14...17 [card]Way of the Fox[/card] 35 recharge, your next 2...7...10 (7 is 12 shadow arts) attacks cannot be blocked. Unlinked lulzors5 [card]Dash[/card] Recharge put to 6 seconds, or duration put to 4. [card]Mark of instability[/card] 5 energy, 3/4 cast time. [card]Recall[/card] you move 5% slower while recall is on, not a large nerf but its easier for people to kite from you. [card]Shadow Walk[/card] Recharge stays at 30, Duration changed to 25. [card]Signet of Twilight[/card] Change loses enchantments, to you lose hex's =P [card]Spirit Walk[/card] Shadow Step to target spirit, and gain 50 health. Target spirit takes 80 damage. [card]Swap[/card] Target Foe, Shadow steps to a nearby location and takes 20...90 damage becomes linked to shadow arts [card]Wastrel's Collapse[/card] Name reverted to shameful waste (thats wtf it is) After 5 seconds, target foe is knocked down. This hex ends prematurely if target foe uses a skill. If this hex ends prematurely, you and all nearby allys are knocked down for 3 seconds and all foes within earshot are knocked down for 3 seconds. - Bohemian Keith Suggests: After 5 seconds, target foe is knocked down and you shadowstep to that foes location. This hex ends prematurely if target foe uses a skill. Shuuda's Suggestions (shudda2) Return - All adjacent foe a crippled for x - xx seconds, and you move 33% faster for x- xx seconds. [card]Death's Charge[/card] - You move 33% faster for x - xx seconds, when this stance ends you gain xx - xxx health. Reduce recharge to 15 - 20 [card]Beguiling Haze[/card] - you move 33% faster for x - xx seconds, the next foe you hit is dazed for x - xx seconds. Change cost to 5, or 10 if 5 is over powered. [card]Shadow Prison[/card] - you move 33% faster for x - xx seconds, the next foe you hit is crippled for x - xx seconds. Change cost to 5 and recharge to 15 - 20. [card]Dark Prison[/card] - You move 15% faster for x - xx seconds, if you hit a moving foe, they are crippled for x - x seconds. Reduce cost to 5 and recharge to 20 [card]Death's retreat[/card] - You move 40% faster for x - x seconds, when this stance ends you gain xx - xx health and an extra xx - xx health for every ally in the area (maxium of xx) ( or replace the extra health gain with a condition for every ally in area max of 1 - 3) [card]Scorpion Wire[/card] - You move 10% faster for x - x seconds, if the next foe you hit is moving, they are knocked down. (50% chance to fail if 4 or less in deadly arts) reduce recharge to 15 - 20. [card]Shadow Meld[/card] - While you maintain this enchantment you move 0 - 33% faster, but you will be unable to use stances. When this enchament ends, you lose all enchaments and 1 condition for each lost. Move to Shadow arts or critical strikes. [card]Aura of Displacement[/card] - While you maintain this enchantment you move 0 - 33% faster, but you are unable to use stances. If you are targeting an ally when this ends, you shadow step to his position and lose all enchantments and stance (range of half radar) reduce cost to 5. Move to Shadow or Critical. (Rusbish I know, but I'm stumpped on how to change that) [card]Shadow Fang[/card] - for x - x seconds you move 25% faster, the next foe to hit will suffer deep wound for x - xx seconds if you critical them. reduce recharge to 15. [card]Shadow Walk[/card] - For x - xx seconds you move 40% faster, but you cannot use or be the target of allied spells or enchantments. Move to shadow arts. reduce recharge to 25. [card]Spirit Walk[/card] - For x - xx seconds you move 33% fasters and gain x - xx health for each second moving if there are allied spirits in the area. [card]Vipers Defense[/card] All adjacent Foes are poisoned for x - xx seconds, and you move 33% faster for x - xx seconds. [card]Swap[/card] - If target Foe is moving faster than normal, they lose xx - xx health and you move 25% faster for x - xx seconds. Move to deadly arts. Increase recharge to 15. or Putting in Shadow arts and giving it a scaled hp and scaled damage eg. 12 shadow arts would give 90 health and spirit takes 130 damage [card]Recall[/card] - If you are targeting an ally you move 40 - 50% faster, if target ally has less health than you when this stance ends, you lose 20 - 10 energy and skill are disabled for 10 - 7 seconds. Move to critical or shadow. [card]Deadly paradox[/card] affects your next 1...3 skills. [card]Mark of Instabilit[/card]adding target foe attacks 25% slower to current skill Note that all stance that have an effect upon hitting a foe will end when you hit them. Okay...I've finished ALL the skills. Now I need feedback and suggestions. So that we can all decide on things. Last edited by ensoriki; Dec 02, 2007 at 12:47 AM // 00:47.. |
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Nov 24, 2007, 01:15 PM // 13:15
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#2 |
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Re:tired
Join Date: Nov 2005
Profession: W/
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Fixing assassins to make them other than an entirely one dimensional class would require a complete overhaul. You may as well just remove them from the game and be done with it.
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Nov 24, 2007, 01:32 PM // 13:32
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#3 |
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Academy Page
Join Date: Mar 2007
Profession: A/
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I have my main as an assassin and although everyone is complaining about the nerf of sins, i really do not mind too much, realistically, all the skills that were nerfed are still going to be used, it just took the class and made people think slightly more about their builds as apposed to " ill get the SP sin".
It makes people re-look as sins and im glad that they are, the "balance" has opened up the class and makes people look to more unused elites/builds. feel free to pick my comments to pieces but thats my view. |
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Nov 24, 2007, 03:40 PM // 15:40
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#4 |
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Frost Gate Guardian
Join Date: Jun 2007
Guild: What A Mess
Profession: W/N
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I don't understand your reasoning behind switching Way of the Assassin's effects to a watered down Locust Fury. Why not keep them the way they are?
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Nov 24, 2007, 03:55 PM // 15:55
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#5 |
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Forge Runner
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Canada bro.
Profession: A/D
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There is no switching, it was a buff.
Promotes variety if they're similar but different. Way of the sin gives higher crit boost and a small chance to dual strike Locust's Fury gives higher Dual strike and a small chance to crit strike. When using skills, way of the assassin is clearly better. Locust's fury provides stronger pressure. Last edited by ensoriki; Nov 24, 2007 at 03:58 PM // 15:58.. |
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Nov 24, 2007, 04:02 PM // 16:02
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#6 | |
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Emo Goth Italics
Join Date: Sep 2006
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Quote:
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Nov 24, 2007, 04:24 PM // 16:24
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#7 |
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Forge Runner
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Canada bro.
Profession: A/D
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Dark aspostasy has the energy loss to prevent it from being IMBA.
Otherwise you have avatar of grenth...the enchantment. ya 20..40 for fox's promise seems fine. No reason not to chance Way of the empty palm though. Shameful Fear is an enemy speed buff of course, balances it out well. Shroud of silence is a bit better than black out, its 6 seconds and with max DA your spells are only disabled for 2. Also blackout disables all of your skills, this leaves you with your attack skills to slaughter. 40 is to long a recharge for scorpion wire, 20/25/ or 15 max. I changed it so that it gives better rewards to positioning. Enduring toxin may be too strong with Foes in the area, in pve this would Intoxicate all enemies AND its automatically reapplies itself. In pvp that would be even worse a hex that reapplys itself, and affects the entire area...monks would throw a fit. The locust fury this is this Theres % to critical and then theres +% to critical, just as there is damage and then there is +damage. +% critical stacks perfectly. Normal % stacks multiplicatively, thus 33% to critical is not actual 33% +33% is. The way of the assassin is a failure update? It just gives it a +10% chance to dual strike on top of what it already has. Lift enchantment removes 4 enchants at 15/16 Deadly arts. and as Deadly arts is utility, the attribute range put in may just be 2---7 points. Thus it will generally only remove an additional 3 enchantments (4) if you knock down. The dark prison thing is a buff actually. Im starting on Shadow arts now >.> I have a bad rep for making shadow refuge to strong. |
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Nov 24, 2007, 04:51 PM // 16:51
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#8 | ||
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Emo Goth Italics
Join Date: Sep 2006
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Quote:
Quote:
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Nov 24, 2007, 05:01 PM // 17:01
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#9 |
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Forge Runner
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Canada bro.
Profession: A/D
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added your suggestion for shadow fang.
Finished the entire assassin line. Need comments and suggestions. |
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Nov 24, 2007, 05:06 PM // 17:06
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#10 |
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Forge Runner
Join Date: Jul 2006
Guild: Guildless
Profession: Me/
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Your suggestions are overpowered as long as Deadly Paradox effects recharge of all spells, change it to effect the next 1 spell only, it fails if you have less than 5 deadly arts.
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Nov 24, 2007, 05:18 PM // 17:18
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#11 |
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Forge Runner
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Canada bro.
Profession: A/D
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Added Shuuda's deadly paradox suggestion.
Changed my suggestion from affecting skills and attacks to affecting enchantments and hexes. |
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Nov 24, 2007, 05:41 PM // 17:41
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#12 |
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Academy Page
Join Date: Jan 2006
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2 cents
Wastrels collapse
After 5 seconds, target foe is knocked down and you shadowstep to that foes location. This hex ends prematurely if target foe uses a skill. I think that would make it equal in strength to SP since SP helps you meet the requirements for hexes this change would allow you to start with a offhand requiring kd. Seems like a good idea to me. |
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Nov 24, 2007, 06:13 PM // 18:13
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#13 | |
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Wilds Pathfinder
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: In a donut hole
Profession: Rt/A
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Quote:
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Nov 24, 2007, 06:14 PM // 18:14
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#14 |
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Forge Runner
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Canada bro.
Profession: A/D
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0_o >.> I'll note your suggestion in a second
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Nov 24, 2007, 07:01 PM // 19:01
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#15 |
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Forge Runner
Join Date: Jul 2006
Guild: Guildless
Profession: Me/
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I also feel that:
- Spirit walk should be added to shadow arts and have the health gain and spirit damage scaling. - The Knock down on Scorpion Wire should scale. - 50% less healing on mark of pain is too much, it should scale 5/10% - 33%, and cost 5e. - Mark of Insecurity should maybe reduce attack speed by 25%. - Swap seems too much, swapping with anything could be havoc for PvP. |
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Nov 24, 2007, 08:07 PM // 20:07
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#16 | |
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Wilds Pathfinder
Join Date: Sep 2007
Profession: W/E
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Quote:
Dark aspostasy: is fine as it is. Locust fury: remove the elite status,make it a stance: while you are in effect of this skill, you cant gain adre. Seeping wound: instead of -1...4 degen => lose 2...8 health each second. Sharpen daggers: make it a skill. If you hit a moving foe, he is cripple... The DW is too much. Augury: if hp drops below 50%, you and target foe suffer from DW and you tele to his position. Last edited by yum; Nov 25, 2007 at 04:51 AM // 04:51.. |
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Nov 24, 2007, 08:28 PM // 20:28
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#17 |
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Forge Runner
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Canada bro.
Profession: A/D
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I prefer my suggestion for wastrels.
In pve, it would give team sync for skilled teams. The assassin goes in (pre-protted) with Wastrels collapse (although anyone can use it =P) casts it on something, and as no allys are nearby they are not knocked down, however all those monsters are... and the ele just nukes em while there down. in GvG, this would also be useful against flaggers or monks, who would have to decide, to continue their action and put their team in a bad situation, or be the sole victim of a normal 2 second knock down. This of course can be removed with Pre-viel =P or if someone else removes it. To balance this wastrel's I made it so that all nearby allys are Also knocked down, so if your team isn't positioned right, They are also knocked down, which can really suck if your monks on the ground while your dying from degen. |
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Nov 25, 2007, 04:11 AM // 04:11
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#18 | ||
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I like yumy food!
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Where I can eat yumy food
Guild: Dead Alley [dR]
Profession: Mo/R
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Quote:
Too bad Izzy feels too much pressure from the little ninja wannabes to nerf the instagib-ness out of existence. That and the fact the Japanese GvG community will completely die, as evidenced by HAnD and Me's pathetic attempt to run a non-sinsplit build. Seriously, I'd rather watch KT vs XoO. Shadowstepping is stupid and annoying, but what Anet should've done was focus on the mobility of the sins (which I'm all for in terms of things like dash and AoD). What actually happened was that they got mobility on top of spammable snares (siphon), instagib against anyone trying to monk with japanlag (expose helped by tiger stance), unprotibility (DA sins) and ridiculous teleporting ability (SP). Quote:
Last edited by Div; Nov 25, 2007 at 04:17 AM // 04:17.. |
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Nov 25, 2007, 04:55 AM // 04:55
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#19 | |
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Wilds Pathfinder
Join Date: Sep 2007
Profession: W/E
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Quote:
And BTW, I want locust none-elite but you cant gain adre under its effect too. Locust is somewhat too specified to be an elite, imo. Last edited by yum; Nov 25, 2007 at 04:58 AM // 04:58.. |
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Nov 25, 2007, 05:56 AM // 05:56
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#20 | |
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Desert Nomad
Join Date: Mar 2006
Profession: W/
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Quote:
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